Monthly Archives: July 2023

The Taxation of Roth IRA Distributions

Roth IRAs allow tax-free distributions to fund retirement. However, to help secure retirement savings and avoid premature raiding of Roth IRAs, Congress did not give them blanket exemption from taxes and penalties. Thus, there are times where distributions from Roth IRAs are subject to either or both ordinary income tax and/or the 10% early withdrawal penalty. The IRS and Treasury have issued regulations governing the rules of the road for Roth IRAs, which interpret the rules Congress wrote in IRC Section 408A

A Few Introductory Notes Before We Get Started

The below post is different from many posts on FITaxGuy.com in two respects. First, my posts tend to be planning focused, though they often dive into tax rules, as a good understanding of the rules helps with planning. This post is almost entirely rules focused rather than planning focused.

Second, the primary audience for this post is tax and financial advisors (though I welcome both laymen and professionals reading and questioning the post). I have recently observed that professionals seem to be confused about the Roth IRA distribution rules. It’s time to lay out the rules with citations to the relevant governing regulations!

Below I lay out my breakdown of the rules with extensive citation to the regulations so you can see where I’m getting my assertions from. You get to be the judge and jury as to whether I have properly presented the relevant rule. 

Now, back to the show. Per Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(a) “[t]he taxability of a distribution from a Roth IRA generally depends on whether or not the distribution is a qualified distribution.” 

Roth IRA Qualified Distributions

A qualified distribution is not included in the Roth IRA’s owner’s gross income (Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)) and is thus tax free and penalty free (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(a)). 

The way most distributions from a Roth IRA qualify as a “qualified distribution” is by satisfying the requirements that the owner (1) is age 59 ½ or older (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)(2)) and (2) has owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)(1)).

Once one qualifies for a qualified distribution by satisfying both the age 59 ½ requirement and the 5 year requirement, he or she no longer has any need to consider either of the two Roth IRA 5-year rules (the so-called 5-Year Conversion Clock and the so-called 5-Year Earnings Clock). 

Roth IRA Nonqualified Distributions

Now we turn to the taxation of distributions that do not qualify as qualified distributions (what I colloquially refer to as “nonqualified distributions”). As a very general matter, the taxation of these distributions is mostly governed by Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&As 1, 4, 5, 8, and 9. 

Ordering Rule

Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 8 provides an ordering rule for distributions from a Roth IRA. This creates three layers. Each layer must be fully withdrawn prior to a subsequent layer being accessed. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 8(a).

First, all annual contributions are withdrawn. Second, all previous Roth conversions are withdrawn (first in, first out). Third, earnings (growth) in the Roth IRA are withdrawn.

Tax Free Withdrawal of Owner Contributions (Both Annual Contributions and Roth Conversions)

Annual contributions and Roth conversions are “contributions” that are always withdrawn income tax free. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b) (contributions always are withdrawn tax free), Q&A 8(a) (annual contributions and Roth conversions are both “contributions”).

Roth IRA annual contributions can be withdrawn at any time for any reason tax and penalty free! See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b) and Q&A 5(a).

5 Year Clock on Roth Conversions

However, the withdrawal of taxable Roth conversions can be subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(b) (see also IRC Section 408A(d)(3)(F)). This is only true if the Roth conversion is withdrawn within 5 years. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(b) (the 5-Year Conversion Clock). 

Per Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(b), the exceptions to the 10% early withdrawal penalty also apply. The most prominent such exception is having attained the age of 59 ½. Thus, a distribution from a Roth IRA received by an owner at least 59 ½ years old will never be subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty.

Roth Earnings

Nonqualified distributions of earnings are subject to ordinary income tax (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 4) and potentially the 10% early withdrawal penalty (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(a)). Generally speaking, if one is either under age 59 ½ years old (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)(2)) or if the owner has not owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)(1), the 5-Year Earnings Clock), any withdrawal of earnings will be subject to ordinary income tax. Further, if one receives a distribution of earnings prior to age 59 ½, they are generally subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty, unless they qualify for another exception

Note that as a practical matter, distributions of earnings received prior to turning age 59 ½ are rare since all previous annual contributions and Roth conversions must be withdrawn prior to a distribution being considered a distribution of earnings

A Quick Note on Roth IRA Aggregation

For purposes of assessing the taxation of a distribution from a Roth IRA, one aggregates all of their Roth IRAs and treats them together as a single Roth IRA. See IRC Section 408A(d)(4), Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 9(a) and (b), and my YouTube video on the subject.  

UPDATE October 30, 2023: I appreciate Andy Ives’s post on IRAHelp.com. He lays out very simply the Roth IRA Distribution rules at the end of this short post. His analysis agrees with mine.

Application to Fact Patterns

Having now covered the universe of the taxation of Roth IRA distributions (both qualified distributions and nonqualified distributions), let’s apply the rules to four examples. 

Example 1: Jorge celebrates his 65th birthday in the year 2023. After his birthday party, he converted $40,000 of his traditional 401(k) to a Roth IRA. The conversion is fully taxable. This is the first time Jorge has owned any Roth IRA. On January 1, 2024, Jorge withdrew $25,000 from his Roth IRA. On January 1, 2025, Jorge withdrew $25,000 from his Roth IRA.

What results in 2024 and 2025?

Jorge, as of both 2024 and 2025, does not meet the criteria for taking a qualified distribution because he has not owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years. Thus, he has a nonqualified distribution in both years. 

In 2024, the $25,000 withdrawal of Roth conversions is income tax free (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)) and is penalty free because Jorge is older than age 59 ½. This demonstrates that the 5-Year Conversion Clock is irrelevant once one turns age 59 ½.  Check out Jorge’s 2024 Form 8606 Part III here (pardon the use of the 2022 version, it’s the latest one available as of this writing).

In 2025, the first $15,000 of Jorge’s withdrawal is a return of Roth conversions and thus not subject to ordinary income tax. Further, this withdrawal is not subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty. The second $10,000 Jorge withdrew is a nonqualified distribution of earnings. Jorge must pay ordinary income tax on those $10,000 (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 4). This withdrawal of earnings violates the 5-Year Earnings Clock and is thus subject to ordinary income tax. However, this withdrawal of earnings is not subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty as Jorge is older than age 59 ½. Check out Jorge’s 2025 Form 8606 Part III here.

Example 2: Samantha celebrates her 45th birthday in the year 2023. After her birthday party, she converted $60,000 of her old traditional 401(k) to a Roth IRA. The conversion is fully taxable. This is the first time Samantha has owned any Roth IRA. On January 1, 2024, Samantha withdrew $25,000 from her Roth IRA. On January 1, 2025, Samantha withdrew $40,000 from her Roth IRA.

What results in 2024 and 2025?

Samantha, as of both 2024 and 2025, does not meet the criteria for taking a qualified distribution because she has not owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years. Thus, she has a nonqualified distribution in both years.

In 2024, Samantha’s withdrawal is a return of Roth conversions and thus not subject to ordinary income tax. However, because the withdrawal is from Roth conversions younger than 5 years old, and Samantha is under age 59 ½, Samantha must pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty ($2,500) on the distribution (she violates the 5-Year Conversion Clock), unless an exception applies.

In 2025, the first $35,000 of Samantha’s withdrawal is a return of Roth conversions and thus not subject to ordinary income tax. However, because the withdrawal is from Roth conversions younger than 5 years old, Samantha must pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty ($3,500) on the distribution (she violates the 5-Year Conversion Clock), unless an exception applies. 

The second $5,000 Samantha withdrew in 2025 is a nonqualified distribution of earnings. Samantha must pay ordinary income tax on those $5,000 (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 4) and generally must pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty ($500) on that $5,000 distribution of earnings, unless an exception applies. 

Example 3: Ed celebrates his 65th birthday in the year 2023. After his birthday party, he converted $40,000 of his old traditional 401(k) to a Roth IRA. The conversion is fully taxable. Ed has owned a Roth IRA since 1998. On January 1, 2024, Ed withdrew $25,000 from his Roth IRA. On January 1, 2025, Ed withdrew $25,000 from his Roth IRA.

What results in 2024 and 2025?

Unlike Examples 1 & 2, we finally have a qualified distribution! Why? Ed has (i) owned a Roth IRA since 1998 (more than 5 years) and (ii) is over age 59 ½. Thus, the only type of distribution Ed can take from his Roth IRA is a qualified distribution. Per Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b), a qualified distribution is tax free. Further, Ed cannot pay the early withdrawal penalty on a distribution from his Roth IRA as he is in his 60s (see also Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(a)). Thus, there is no tax and no penalty on either the 2024 distribution or the 2025 distribution. 

Example 4: This example is based on my conversation with Brad Barrett on a recent episode of the ChooseFI podcast. Jonathan turns age 57 on July 1, 2023. He’s never had a Roth IRA. On July 1, 2023, he converted $50,000 from a traditional IRA to a Roth IRA. The conversion is fully taxable.

What withdrawal constraints does Jonathan have on his Roth IRA?

If Jonathan withdraws up to $50,000 from his Roth IRA prior to turning age 59 ½ on January 1, 2026, Jonathan will have to pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty as he violates the 5-Year Conversion Clock (unless an exception applies). 

If Jonathan cumulatively withdraws amounts in excess of $50,000 from his Roth IRA prior to turning age 59 ½, he will pay ordinary income tax on the withdrawal of those earnings (as he violates the 5-Year Earnings Clock) and he will pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty (unless an exception applies).

From January 1, 2026 through December 31, 2027, if Jonathan cumulatively withdraws amounts in excess of $50,000 from his Roth IRA, he will pay ordinary income tax on the withdrawal of those earnings (as he violates the 5-Year Earnings Clock). However, Jonathan will not pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty. Starting on January 1, 2028, Jonathan satisfies the 5-Year Earnings Clock (see Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 2) and is now permanently able to take a qualified distribution from his Roth IRA going forward.

Example 5: Denzel celebrates his 35th birthday in the year 2023. After his birthday party, he contributed $6,500 to a traditional IRA on July 1, 2023. He cannot deduct the contribution based on his income level. On August 2, 2023, at a time the traditional IRA was worth $6,502, he converted the entire traditional IRA to a Roth IRA, completing a Backdoor Roth IRA. This is the first time Denzel has owned any Roth IRA. He owned no traditional IRAs, SEP IRAs, and/or SIMPLE IRAs on December 31, 2023. Denzel reported $2 of taxable income on his 2023 tax return due to the Backdoor Roth IRA. 

On January 16, 2024, Denzel withdrew $3,000 from his Roth IRA and made no contributions to his Roth IRA during 2024.

What results in 2024?

Denzel, as of 2024, does not meet the criteria for taking a qualified distribution because he has not owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years. Thus, he has a nonqualified distribution in 2024.

Pursuant to Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 8(b), the taxable portion of the Roth conversion ($2 out of $6,502) comes out first. That $2 is subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty (a $0.20 penalty which rounds down to $0) since he violates the 5-Year Conversion Clock, unless an exception applies. This $2 constitutes what I colloquially refer to as a micro layer inside the Roth IRA: for 5 years it is subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty if withdrawn (unless an exception applies). 

However, the $2 recovery of the taxable Roth conversion is not subject to ordinary income tax. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b).

Second, the $2,998 nontaxable portion of the Roth conversion is distributed out. This nonqualified distribution is subject to neither ordinary income tax nor the 10% early withdrawal penalty. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b), 5(a), and 5(b). Check out Denzel’s 2024 Form 8606 Part III here.

There is some confusion on this latter result. Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 4 provides that only once all of the owner’s previous “contributions” have been withdrawn are nonqualified Roth IRA distributions subject to ordinary income tax. For this purpose, it is clear from reading Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 8(a) that “contributions” include both “annual contributions” and “Roth conversions.” See also Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(b) providing that the 10% early withdrawal penalty does not hit withdrawals of nontaxable converted amounts (“For purposes of applying the tax, only the amount of the conversion contribution includible in gross income as a result of the conversion is taken into account.”). Thus, the nontaxable portion of a Backdoor Roth IRA can be recovered tax and penalty free at any time for any reason. 

Other than the minor potential Backdoor Roth IRA micro layer issue, a Backdoor Roth IRA could, in theory, serve as an emergency fund (though generally we want to plan for long term Roth IRA tax-free growth).

Roth IRA Distributions Summary Chart

Type of DistributionOrdinary Income Tax10% Early Withdrawal PenaltyNotes
Qualified DistributionNeverNeverMain way to qualify: attain age 59 ½ and own Roth IRA for 5 years.
NQ Return of Annual ContributionsNeverNeverComes out prior to returns of conversions and earnings.
NQ Return of Roth ConversionsNeverCan apply. Applies if the taxable conversion is less than 5 years old and the owner is under age 59 ½ (though exceptions can apply).Come out “FIFO” (first-in, first out).
NQ Distribution of EarningsAlwaysYes, if the owner is under age 59 ½ (though exceptions can apply).Come out only if all prior annual contributions and conversions have been withdrawn.
NQ stands for nonqualified

Exceptions to the 59 ½ Year Age Requirement

It is possible to qualify for a qualified distribution if one is younger than 59 ½ years of age. It happens if (1) the 5-Year Earnings Clock is satisfied and (2) the Roth IRA owner (i) is using the money for a first-time home purchase (limit of $10,000), or (ii) is disabled, or (iii) has died. See Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b)(2). Outside of the owner’s death, these situations are rare. 

Resources

Notice this post cites the to regulation and occasionally the Internal Revenue Code. That’s because they are the law of land! The Code is the primary law of the land, but it tends to be written in a manner inaccessible to most laymen and difficult for many professionals to understand. The regulations interpret the Code. While not an elementary school level read, Treas. Reg. Section 1.408A-6 is much more comprehensible than the Code. The regulation’s question and answer format makes it much easier to digest.

IRS Publication 590-B, Distributions from Individual Retirement Arrangements (IRAs), is an IRS publication. As such it is (i) informative and (ii) not binding authority on either the IRS or on taxpayers. Please understand both when using an IRS publication. I will note that Publication 590-B has an excellent flowchart (Figure 2-1) which can be used to help determine if a distribution from a Roth IRA is a qualified distribution. 

FI Tax Guy can be your financial planner! Find out more by visiting mullaneyfinancial.com

Follow me on Twitter at @SeanMoneyandTax

This post is for entertainment and educational purposes only. It does not constitute accounting, financial, investment, legal, or tax advice. Please consult with your advisor(s) regarding your personal accounting, financial, investment, legal, and tax matters. Please also refer to the Disclaimer & Warning section found here.

How I Learned to Stop Worrying About the Roth IRA 5 Year Rules

You know what gets too much attention in the personal finance space? The two five-year Roth IRA rules. 

Why do I say that? Because the odds are extremely low that either rule will ever impact most Roth IRA owners. While the rules theoretically have wide effect, in practice, discussed further below, they rarely impact the taxation of Roth IRA distributions.

Before I get started, below is a summary table of the two five-year rules (or five-year clocks, use whichever terminology you prefer). The table is not comprehensive, but rather intended to cover the vast majority of situations. I hope you find this table to be a useful reference regarding the two five-year rules. 

RuleTax BiteAgeCode SectionRegulation
First Five-Year RuleOrdinary income tax on withdrawal of earnings from Roth IRA onlyGenerally bites only if owner is over 59 ½ years old408A(d)(2)(B)1.408A-6 Q&A 2
Second Five-Year Rule10% early withdrawal penalty on withdrawal of taxable converted amounts from Roth IRA onlyOnly bites if owner is under age 59 ½ 408A(d)(3)(F)1.408A-6 Q&A 5(b)

First Five-Year Rule: Earnings Cannot Be Withdrawn Income Tax Free From a Roth IRA Unless the Account Holder has Owned a Roth IRA for Five Full Tax Years

At first, this rule seems daunting. As written, it applies to anyone owning a Roth IRA. But in practice, it rarely has any bite. First, the rule only serves to disqualify a distribution from being a “qualified distribution.” 

Here’s the thing: outside of rare circumstances (see “Two Uncommon Situations” below), anyone under age 59 ½ cannot receive a “qualified distribution” from their own Roth IRA regardless of the first five-year rule.

Thus, as a general matter, the first five-year rule is a rule that only applies to those age 59 ½ and older

For those doubting me, I’ll prove it with two examples:

Example 1: Ernestine turns age 25 in the year 2023. In March, she made a $6,500 annual contribution to a Roth IRA for the year 2023. This is her only ever Roth IRA contribution. In 2026, when the Roth IRA is worth $8,000 and Ernestine turns age 28, Ernestine withdraws all $8,000 from the Roth IRA. The first $6,500 is a nontaxable return of the $6,500 contribution, and the remaining $1,500 is a taxable distribution of earnings subject to both ordinary income tax and the 10 percent early withdrawal penalty

Example 2: Hortense turns age 25 in the year 2023. In March, she made a $6,500 annual contribution to a Roth IRA for the year 2023. This is her only ever Roth IRA contribution. In 2030, when the Roth IRA is worth $8,000 and Hortense turns age 32, Hortense withdraws all $8,000 from the Roth IRA. The first $6,500 is a nontaxable return of the $6,500 contribution, and the remaining $1,500 is a taxable distribution of earnings subject to both ordinary income tax and the 10 percent early withdrawal penalty. 

Ernestine did not satisfy the first five-year rule, Hortense did. Notice that it did not matter! Both must pay ordinary income tax and the 10% early withdrawal penalty on the $1,500 of earnings they each received from their Roth IRA. The first five-year rule had absolutely no impact on the taxation of the withdrawal because both Roth IRA owners are under age 59 ½. This proves that outside unusual circumstances, the first five-year rule has no impact on those under age 59 ½.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: Previous annual contributions to a Roth IRA can be withdrawn from a Roth IRA tax and penalty free at any time for any reason! The first five-year rule has nothing to do with withdrawals of previously made contributions. See Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 1(b) (previous contributions are withdrawn tax free) and Q&A 5(a) (tax free withdrawals of previous regular annual contributions are not subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty).

So when the heck does the first five-year rule matter? Here are two examples to help us figure it out.

Example 3: Ernie turns age 58 in the year 2023. In March, he made a $7,500 annual contribution to a Roth IRA for the year 2023. This is his only ever Roth IRA contribution. In 2026, when the Roth IRA is worth $10,000 and Ernie turns age 61, Ernie withdraws all $10,000 from the Roth IRA. The first $7,500 is a nontaxable return of the $7,500 contribution, and the remaining $2,500 is a taxable distribution of earnings subject to ordinary income tax. Ernie does not pay the 10 percent early withdrawal penalty because he is over age 59 ½ when he receives the earnings. 

Example 4: Harry turns age 58 in the year 2023. In March, he made a $7,500 annual contribution to a Roth IRA for the year 2023. This is his only ever Roth IRA contribution. In 2030, when the Roth IRA is worth $10,000 and Harry turns age 65, Harry withdraws all $10,000 from the Roth IRA. As Harry satisfies both the first five-year rule and is over age 59 ½, the entire $10,000 distribution is a qualified distribution and thus entirely tax and penalty free.

We’ve found where the first five-year rule matters! Generally speaking, the first-five year rule only bites when applied to a distribution of earnings if the recipient is over the age of 59 ½. Further, it only applies to subject the earnings to ordinary income tax, not the 10% early withdrawal penalty (as being age 59 ½ or older is always a valid exception to the early withdrawal penalty). 

Remember, though, in most cases it is difficult to access Roth IRA earnings. Why? Because earnings come out of a Roth IRA last. Ernie’s fact pattern is rare. Many Roth IRA owners will have years of contributions and/or conversions inside their Roth IRA. As I have previously discussed, nonqualified distributions from Roth IRAs first access Roth IRA contributions and then access Roth IRA conversions before they can access a penny of earnings. See also Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 8 and Natalie B. Choate’s Life and Death Benefits for Retirement Planning (8th Ed. 2019), page 328. 

Further, in today’s world, most (though not all) 59 ½ year old Roth IRA owners will satisfy the five-year rule. All Roth IRAs are aggregated for this purpose, so the funding (through a contribution or conversion) of any Roth IRA starts the five-year clock as of January 1st of the year for which the contribution was made. See Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 2. 

Two Uncommon Situations: There are two uncommon situations in which a Roth IRA owner under age 59 ½ receiving a Roth IRA distribution could save the ordinary income tax by satisfying the first five-year rule. The first is the taking of an up-to $10,000 first-time home buyer distribution. See Choate, previously referenced, at page 612. The second is if the owner is disabled as defined by Section 72(m)(7). Both are rare situations. Further, in both such cases, satisfying the first five-year rule would be irrelevant if the distribution would have been a return of contributions, nontaxable conversions, and/or taxable conversions at least 5 years old. 

Inherited Roth IRA Twist: The first five-year rule can affect distributions from an inherited Roth IRA. I’ve heard this referred to as the third Roth IRA five-year rule, but I view it as simply a continuation of the first five-year rule. A withdrawal of earnings by a beneficiary from an inherited Roth IRA made less than five tax years after the owner originally funded the Roth IRA is subject to ordinary income tax. See Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 7.  These situations are quite rare. 

If Anyone on Capitol Hill is Reading This . . .

The first five-year rule serves no compelling purpose, and is superfluous as applied to most taxpayers under the age of 59 ½.

Perhaps in 1997 Congress worried about quick withdrawals from Roth IRAs. Now that we fully understand that contributions and conversions come out of Roth IRAs first, and that being under age 59 ½ prevents a tax-free distribution of earnings in most cases, there’s no reason for the first five-year rule. Being age 59 ½ or older (or death, disability, or first-time home buyer) should be sufficient to receive a qualified distribution. 

I recommend that Congress repeal the first five-year rule by removing Section 408A(d)(2)(B) from the Internal Revenue Code as part of retirement tax simplification.

Second Five-Year Rule: Taxable Conversions Are Subject to the Ten Percent Early Withdrawal Penalty if Withdrawn from the Roth IRA Within Five Taxable Years

This rule is much more logical than the first five-year rule. The reason has nothing to do with Roth IRAs. Rather, the reason is to protect the 10% early withdrawal penalty as applied to traditional IRAs and traditional workplace plans such as 401(k)s and 403(b)s. Without the second five-year rule, taxpayers would never pay the 10% early withdrawal penalty. 

Rather, taxpayers under age 59 1/2 would simply convert any money they want to withdraw from a traditional retirement account to a Roth IRA, and then shortly thereafter withdraw the amount from the Roth IRA tax-free as a return of old contributions or of the conversion itself. 

The second five-year rule prevents the total evisceration of the 10% early withdrawal penalty. 

The second five-year rule applies separately to each taxable Roth conversion. Each Roth conversion that occurs during a year is deemed to occur January 1st of that year for purposes of the second five-year rule. See Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 5(c).

Note further that the second five-year rule has nothing to do with income tax: its bite only triggers the distribution being subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty. 

When Might the Second Roth IRA Five-Year Rule Apply

I am not too worried about the application of the second five-year rule. Here’s why.

First, the second five-year rule is not likely to apply while one is working. During the accumulation phase, many are looking to contribute to, not withdraw from, Roth IRAs.

Second, for those retiring after age 59 ½, the second five-year rule will have practically no impact, as (i) they are not likely to take pre-retirement distributions from their Roth IRA, and (ii) distributions taken from the Roth IRA by the owner after turning age 59 ½ are never subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty. 

Third, many early retirees will choose to live off taxable assets first in early retirement. As a result, many will not access Roth accounts until age 59 ½ or later, and thus the second five-year rule will not be relevant. 

However, some will choose to employ a Roth Conversion Ladder strategy with respect to an early retirement. Here the second five-year rule might bite. Let’s consider a quick example:

Example 5: Josh is considering retiring in 2024 when he turns age 50. In his 30s, he qualified to make an annual Roth IRA contribution and maxed out his Roth IRA each year. In his 40s, he made income in excess of the annual MAGI limits on Roth IRA contributions, so he maxed out the Backdoor Roth IRA for each year. He plans on living on taxable assets for the first five years of retirement and then living off Roth conversion ladders from age 55 through age 59 ½. Josh has never previously taken a distribution from a Roth IRA.

Here is Josh’s Roth IRA history in table form. Thanks to Investopedia for the historic annual contribution maximums

YearAgeRoth IRA ContributionBackdoor Roth IRATaxable Amount
200430$3,000
200531$4,000
200632$4,000
200733$4,000
200834$5,000
200935$5,000
201036$5,000
201137$5,000
201238$5,000
201339$5,500
201440$5,502$2
201541$5,503$3
201642$5,501$1
201743$5,502$2
201844$5,501$1
201945$6,001$1
202046$6,002$2
202147$6,002$2
202248$6,001$1
202349$6,004$4

If Josh started withdrawing from his Roth IRA in 2024, he would first withdraw all $45,500 of previous annual contributions (all tax and penalty free) and then withdraw all $33,510 of his 2014 through 2019 Backdoor Roth IRAs (all tax and penalty free) before he could take a distribution with respect to which the second five-year rule could bite. 

Note that for withdrawals of up to $79,010, it is irrelevant that Josh does not satisfy the second five-year rule with respect to the 2020 through 2023 Backdoor Roth IRAs. Josh can withdraw up to $79,010 entirely tax and penalty free in 2024. Perhaps the second five-year rule’s bark is worse than its bite . . .

If, in 2024, Josh withdraws both of the above listed amounts from his Roth IRA, then yes, the next $2 of withdrawals in 2024 would be from the $2 taxable amount of his 2020 Backdoor Roth IRA, which would be subject to the 10% early withdrawal penalty ($0.20) under the second five-year rule. 

In Josh’s extreme example, the second five-year rule bites, but, as you can see, it barely bites!

As an aside, assuming Josh continues to withdraw money from his Roth IRA in 2024, the next $6,000 is a tax and penalty free return of the non-taxable portion of his 2020 Backdoor Roth IRA! See Treas. Reg. Sec. 1.408A-6 Q&A 8. The generosity of the Roth IRA nonqualified distribution rules is, by itself, a reason not to sweat the two Roth IRA five-year clocks too much. 

Assuming Josh follows through with his plan and waits until age 55 (the year 2029) to start withdrawing from his Roth IRA, he can access all of his 30s Roth IRA annual contributions ($45,500), all of his 40s Backdoor Roth IRAs ($57,519), and whatever amount he converted to his Roth IRA in 2024 tax and penalty free in 2029! After that, however, the second five-year rule will bite ten cents on the dollar for amounts additionally distributed in 2029, since amounts converted in 2025 or later would still be subject to the second five-year rule if distributed in 2029. 

In Josh’s early retirement example, assuming Josh takes no distributions from his Roth IRA until age 55, the second five-year rule can only possibly bite from age 55 to 59 ½, and even then, the combination of years of built up Roth basis and affirmative planning make that possibility at least somewhat remote. 

Don’t over think it: If the owner of a Roth IRA is 59 1/2 years old or older, and has owned a Roth IRA for at least 5 years, all distributions they receive from a Roth IRA are qualified distributions and thus fully tax and penalty free. In such circumstances, the 5-year clocks are entirely irrelevant.

Conclusion

It’s perfectly cromulent to proceed with financial planning without too much worry about the two Roth IRA five-year rules. For personal finance nerds (myself included), the two Roth IRA five-year clocks can be fun to dive into. But from a practical standpoint, they rarely impact the taxation of distributions from Roth IRAs. The two five-year clocks are best understood as sporadically applicable exceptions to the general rule that most nonqualified distributions from Roth IRAs are tax and penalty free.

Further Reading

For even more on Roth IRA distributions, please read this post, which goes through the details of Roth IRA distributions, including citations to the relevant regulations and links to three example Forms 8606 Part III.

FI Tax Guy can be your financial planner! Find out more by visiting mullaneyfinancial.com

Follow me on Twitter at @SeanMoneyandTax

This post is for entertainment and educational purposes only. It does not constitute accounting, financial, investment, legal, or tax advice. Please consult with your advisor(s) regarding your personal accounting, financial, investment, legal, and tax matters. Please also refer to the Disclaimer & Warning section found here.